Was Moses Polygamous?

Proponent for polygamy	My reply
The Bible does not say that Zipporah was from the land of Cush or Ethiopia.	The wife of Moses was a Cushite, according to the Book of Numbers 12:1. Exagoge 60-65 by Ezekiel the Tragedian (fragments reproduced in Eusebius) has Zipporah describe herself to Moses as a stranger in the land of Midian, and proceeds to describe the inhabitants of her ancestral lands in Africa: "Stranger, this land is called Libya {an ancient name for the African continent}. It is inhabited by tribes of various peoples, Ethiopians, dark men. One man is the ruler of the land: he is both king and general. He rules the state, judges the people, and is priest. This man is my father {Jethro} and theirs." Also, “Scholars like Johann Michaelis and Rosenmuller have pointed out that the name Cush was applied to tracts of country on both sides of the Red Sea in the Arabia (Yemen) and in Africa. In the 5th century AD, the Himyarites in the south of Arabia were styled by Syrian writers as Cushaeans and Ethiopians.”
I hate to say it, but you are repeating a common argument presented by opponents of polygamy, regarding Zipporah and the Ethiopian woman as being the same woman. They are not. And a little closer attention to the detail of scripture will demonstrate that these woman come from different countries and different lineages.	Not according to my research.
The first wife of Moses (Zipporah) is the daughter of the priest of Midian. It is important that we understand that she is a Midianite and the Midianites are descendants of Abraham.	Jethro is called a priest of Midian and became father-in-law of Moses after he gave his daughter, Zipporah, in marriage to Moses, not a Midianite. Jethro, priest of Midian, and father-in-law of Moses, is "said" to have been a Kenite, but merely live in the land of Cannan and the Midianites. Judges 1:16.
Midian is located south of Israel in the west, on the eastern side of the Gulf of Aqabah.	True, but so was Cush.
Ethiopia is south of Egypt proper in Africa.. The existence of the historical Kingdom of Kush in what is now areas of southern Egypt, and Sudan cannot be reasonably questioned. (Wikipedia)	Yes, but keep reading, “The existence of the historical Kingdom of Kush in what is now areas of southern Egypt and Sudan cannot be reasonably questioned, although the term may later have been employed with some latitude. Mike, if you research ancient maps you will certainly find Kush in parts of what is now part of Arabia. Go to http://nabataea.net/eden4.html and soak that information in.
The Midianites are the descendants of Midian a son of Abraham and Keturah.	Really, what does that prove? Jethro only lived among them, he was a  Kenite.
The Kenites?	The Kenites are not pure Midianites. They only lived among them, as far as I can tell. Careful research will show that Kenite clans were distributed all over the ancient world. As far north as Syria and into Ethiopia. They intermingled with the people of the regions and kept their distinctive clannish name because of their language. Some were black and from Ethiopia, some were lesser shades, depending on where and how long they lived and intermingled with the existing population.
In Genesis 25:1-2 we read, “Then again Abraham took a wife, and her name was Keturah. And she bare him Zimran, and Jokshan, and Medan, and Midian, and Ishbak, and Shuah.”	So? Again, what does that prove? Jethro only lived among them, he was a Kenite.
This is necessary to establish that Zippora is not confused with his Ethiopian wife in Numbers 12. Many assume that the numbers 12 wife is Zipporah. However, the Numbers 12 wife is clearly a Cushite or Ethiopian which was a descendant of Ham, whereas Midian, a son of Abraham, was a descendant of Noah’s son Shem. Thus, these would not be the same women.	Same o same o
“And the sons of Ham; Cush, and Mizraim, and Phut, and Canaan” (Genesis 10:6).	Yep, that’s right.
Zipporah was not from Cush as you have erroneously repeated. The bible does not say she was from Cush. Since her daddy Jethro is a Midian priest, we must assume they are Midianites unless specifically told otherwise in scripture.	Well, since she was, I believe the same person we have been referring to as Moses’ wife, I believe she was. The point is Mike, you guys are straining at a nit to prove a point. I just don’t see it. It goes against solid historical research, only part of which I have given.
When we understand that Jethro and his daughters did not come from Cush/Ethiopia, but from Midian, two separate peoples and regions, we are able to understand that the Ethiopian woman of Numbers 12 is not Zipporah the daughter of Jethro a Midianite priest. She was clearly identified as a Cushite, a desendant of Cush.	Not so clear to me.
Are we looking for God's truth which causes scripture to fully harmonize? Or do we seek the approval of those who expect us to believe as they do?	Far as I am concerned scripture does harmonize. There you go again, Mike, pointing a finger, questioning someone’s courage. Stop it! Quit playing God. Be nice. God is big enough to handle my conscience.
Accepting and teaching the truth of biblical polygamy would cost many ministers their ministries and their financial support. They have much to lose. We all have the right to be wrong,,, and where shall we stand	What has that got to do with the price of tea in China? If you have me in mind, I ain’t got no money to lose. Yeah, I have a right, but not a desire to be wrong on anything, particularly things pertaining to God.
At the bema seat, where all of our works are tried to see if they are wood hay & stubble, or silver and gold. I do not care if the majority want to believe and teach the same traditions of man. It takes man of God to stand for and preach all of God's truths, especially the truths that might cost a man his esteem and his following.	I think I lost all my fear of men when I was a kid preaching on the street corner with all of my class mates walking by jeering. I’ve got self esteem, but no following. Sad to say. And, if I did, I would turn them around and point them to Jesus and ask them to follow him.
I do not believe the New Testament teaches monogamy only. I believe that is a tradition of man based on misunderstanding of scripture. I believe Rome was responsible for twisting this truth and selling it to the Church.	Huummmm. Guess we must disagree on that. No, I really think that what often happens is that we many times subconsciously try to justify our own idiosyncrasies or foibles.

Mary: Our Exemplification

‘Yes’ is the most powerful word in the Christian lexicon. Yes is indeed more than just a word. Yes is an act, a moral response to the universe. Yes far exceeds all other words in that it embodies verbally and indeed initiates a receptive heart in obedience to the invitation of our Savior to come unto Him, not just for salvation, but also from our labors and weariness. (Matthew 11:28 (KJV)

For, unless we say, “Yes” to Christ as God’s “Divine Yes” to our finiteness we will never find a lasting solution to the human predicament. By this, I mean that humanity must face its finiteness, and the only proper response is “Yes.” Yes, I am human. Yes, I will die. Yes, there are limits to technological achievements. Yes, civilized society requires moral restraints. Yes, sexuality has purpose that overrides pleasure. Yes, the sexes do have a vital and meaningful role in societal stability other than the perpetuation of the human species. Yes, financial exploitation is wrong. Yes, war is an amoral answer to an immoral quandary—but, ultimately a non-answer.

Mary, the mother of our Lord, in my opinion, exemplifies the purest response—at the annunciation she gently, yet bodly declares: “Behold, the handmaid of the Lord; be it to me according to your word.” (Luke 1:26) Her volitional response was only possible in that she was fully prepared in a functional grace that only God can give; albeit, not without our humble acquiesce.

Consider for a moment her response in full. In the Bible, the Annunciation is narrated in the book of Luke, Chapter 1, verses 26-38 (WEB), as follows:


Now in the sixth month, the angel Gabriel was sent from God to a city of Galilee, named Nazareth, to a virgin pledged to be married to a man whose name was Joseph, of the house of David. The virgin’s name was Mary. Having come in, the angel said to her, “Rejoice, you highly favored one! The Lord is with you. Blessed are you among women!” But when she saw him, she was greatly troubled at the saying, and considered what kind of salutation this might be. The angel said to her, “Don’t be afraid, Mary, for you have found favor with God. Behold, you will conceive in your womb, and bring forth a son, and will call his name ‘Jesus.’ He will be great, and will be called the Son of the Most High. The Lord God will give him the throne of his father, David, and he will reign over the house of Jacob forever. There will be no end to his Kingdom.” Mary said to the angel, “How can this be, seeing I am a virgin?” The angel answered her, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. Therefore also the holy one who is born from you will be called the Son of God. Behold, Elizabeth, your relative, also has conceived a son in her old age; and this is the sixth month with her who was called barren. For everything spoken by God is possible.” Mary said, “Behold, the handmaid of the Lord; be it to me according to your word.” The angel departed from her. (Italics mine)

This exemplification is best understood in the following ways:

Firstly, if God ever sent an angel on a mission impossible, this was it. Mary fully understood this. She, therefore, responded with an incredulous “How can this be, seeing I am a virgin?”—which, by the way, shows maturity, even for a teenager. Gullibility is not a saintly trait.

Therefore, Mary’s response is best understood as one whose heart had been prepared through Grace. I use through, rather than by, because this was a cooperative partnership between her and God. God in his part blessed her, but she was beyond reproach because God found favor in her. So, for each of us there is only one proper response to Grace—that is, “Yes.” Her reply, however, was only the final initiating response; the conditioning response came much earlier. She had prepared herself by remaining chaste in thought and deed. Because of that, she found favor. Only the righteous shall see the Kingdom.

Saying yes, however, is never enough. We must acquiesce to His purpose. Therefore, she responded, “Behold, the handmaid of the Lord; be it to me according to your word.” Hearing from God is not the same as obedience, however. Many have heard God’s message; few are willing to fulfill his purpose. Not so with Mary. No wonder, as the song goes, they call her blessed.

Now, at this point in the narrative, nothing has happened except the encounter and the promise. The best is yet to come. But, not yet. The angel has departed from her. Now, the mundane cries for immediacy. Yet, she must wait. She must trust. She must believe. Faith can only take her to the River of Jordan, so to speak, only God can carry her across. Therefore, she finds comfort in her reoccurring spiritual anxiousness in the words of the angel that at the given time, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you.”

That, however, will take a miracle. So, understandably there are times in our lives that we too must ponder these personal encounters with the Divine in our hearts. Reason, logic and the carnal mind is not capable of such spiritual preponderance.

The promise to the mother of our Lord, however, is clear, “The Holy Spirit will come on you, and the power of the Most High will overshadow you. Therefore also the holy one who is born from you will be called the Son of God.”

In this case, it is interesting to note that God’s promises are never without provision. Therefore, to affirm God’s purposes is to expect Divine intervention to fulfill His intention. So, in a real sense, God’s intention is our potential.

Jim R

"Jesus never condemned homosexuality. So, why do you?"

Well, technically speaking Jesus said he did not come to condemn, but to give life. John said,

"For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world; but that the world through him might be saved." (John 3:17)

However, to say that Jesus did not address the homosexual issue, at least by inference, is simply not true.

Jesus said, [that] from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female. For this cause shall a man leave his father and mother, and cleave to his wife; And they twain shall be one flesh: so then they are no more twain, but one flesh. What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder."  (Mark 10: 6-9)

This is in line with and in the broader context of the Genesis account and the proscriptions against homosexuality in both the Old and New Testament. To cleave to ones partner (as in marriage) and become one flesh through the sexual act, is what Jesus had in mind. The command to go forth and multiply is inclusive in the purpose of marriage and sexual partnerships; and is most surely something that homosexual partners can not do.

"My husband has been unfaithful. What should I do?"

So, your spouse has been unfaithful. Are you sure? If so, and you want to try and make it work that is your choice. Many marriages that have gone wrong have been saved, and the offending spouse forgiven. Pastoral care and marriage counseling is highly suggested. However, whatever the case, plan your strategy and confront them and give them an ultimatum. Either they shape up — which means they stop their foolishness, immediately; or ship out. You make sure you don't leave; make them leave, even if you have to get a restraining order. You and the children (if there are any) deserve a decent place to live! Above all, don't let them string you along. They have already proven that they are a liar and a cheat, and don't expect them to act any differently unless they honestly change. Crocodile tears are not acceptable, either. Make them prove it, and let them know in no uncertain terms that you will be checking up on them.

Why do I say this? Because you are taking a big chance sleeping with someone who is sleeping with someone else. God only knows the disease that they may bring home. For, as a matter of fact, you will be sleeping with everyone that their partner has slept with in reality. Think of that! It could extrapolate out into the hundreds. With AIDS and STDs and all going around the way it is these days, you are taking a big chance! That's for sure.

Now, you have a Scriptural right to divorce them, if you wish. Here is what Jesus said:

Matt. 5: 31"It has been said, 'Anyone who divorces his wife must give her a certificate of divorce.'[f] 32But I tell you that anyone who divorces his wife, except for marital unfaithfulness, causes her to become an adulteress, and anyone who marries the divorced woman commits adultery." (Of course, this refers to both husband and wife)

Now, I have a whole lot of advice I could give, but let me sum it up by saying what ever you do, make sure you do not drag the kids (if you have any) through the mud with you. Make it as civil as possible; but hold your grounds.

There is hardly anything any lower than an adulterer; however, God does forgive, and if we have the grace, so should we. Forgiveness, however, does not mean that we remain naive.

Forgiveness, remember, requires repentance on their part. You can not forgive someone that does not want forgiveness. They may want you to overlook it, but may not feel sorry, except for the fact that they got caught. So, be careful not to get sucked into a false “I am so sorry” story.

There are a couple of other suggestions that I have:

1. Pray for him and the other lady/ladies.

2. Make sure that you have also repented of any sins in your life, also.

During the meantime, may I suggest that you read the following?

Marriage and the Home (To access just click on the title, left)

My prayers are with you!

"Is Masturbation Wrong?"

Well, I assume you are not married. Because, if you are, then you are facing other problems.

My dear friend, you probably know that Jesus said in Matthew 5:27-28, "Ye have heard that it was said by them of old time, Thou shalt not commit adultery:" "But I say unto you, That whosoever looketh on a woman to lust after her hath committed adultery with her already in his heart."

So, if we lust after a woman/or man that is the same as committing adultery; so this can be a very serious thing. However, I want you to know that God understands human sexuality, and since I sense that you are very serious about wanting to please God and you are making an honest effort to stop, then I would not walk around with all that guilt. Statistically, I would say that the rate for young unmarried men masturbating is almost 100%; and for women probably somewhere around 60%. Does that make it right? No, but it does bring the problem into focus more clearly. You are most probably not suffering from anything that others have not suffered at one time or the other, too.

Masturbation while watching porno, as with all sex, can become addictive. It sounds as if you are really addicted to sex, and that is a serious psychological and spiritual problem, so you need help. Here is a website link that should help you:

Men: http://xxxchurch.com/gethelp/men/

Women: http://xxxchurch.com/gethelp/women/intro.html

However, don’t just use the link as a mild form of pornography; but rather see the therapy available there as a tool to help you.

Let me know how all of this turns out.

Now, let me pray with you.

PRAYER

Our most gracious and loving Heavenly Father, who gave us your son, as a man, subject to all temptation, yet without sin, I pray that you will help our friend overcome this sexual addiction. Help them to think clear, pure thoughts. In the name of Jesus Christ our Lord with whom all things are possible. AMEN

"Is it a sin to be born and found yourself gay?"

My dear homosexual friend,

You asked, so I must assume that you are sincere.

First of all, in response to your question: "Is it a sin to be born and found yourself gay?"

Apparently, you think it is possible, or you would not be asking the question. However, in all honesty, since I am not gay, nor do I have any desire to be gay, I cannot put myself in anyone's shoe that is gay. I have some gay friends; however, I have never really discussed their feelings or why they chose to be gay.

I do know, however, that the Bible says in Genesis 1:26,27,31:

Then God said,

Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground. So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them. God saw all that he had made, and it was very good.

So, there are a couple of observations that can be made here. One, we are created with Godlike qualities (in His image), so in my opinion that is a high standard. Secondly, God created male and female, and after it was all done, the Scripture says, “God saw all he had made and it was very good.”

From that I gather, God felt that making male and female was good. Now, following that, we are all aware that the Old Testament laws were totally against homosexuality in any form. And, that brings us to the New Testament. The New Testament is also very strongly opposed to homosexuality. Romans chapter one is a good example. Now, I know that some say, “Well, the Bible also condoned slavery, and we don’t practice slavery anymore, so how can we just take the Bible or some preacher’s word on what is right and wrong as far as anything goes(?).”

However, without going into great detail, the New Testament, in my opinion, never condoned slavery. As a matter of fact, in the letter to Philemon, verses 12—16, Paul says that he is sending a runaway slave by the name of Onesimus back to his owner, Philemon, with these words:

“I am sending him—who is my very heart—back to you. I would have liked to keep him with me so that he could take your place in helping me while I am in chains for the gospel. But I did not want to do anything without your consent, so that any favor you do will be spontaneous and not forced. Perhaps the reason he was separated from you for a little while was that you might have him back for good— no longer as a slave, but better than a slave, as a dear brother. He is very dear to me but even dearer to you, both as a man and as a brother in the Lord.”

So, in conclusion, let me say, one is skating on some thin ice, morally, to excuse homosexuality activity off as that was the way they were born. Now, that does not take away the desire, or the complications, I realize. Just to say that something is a sin is not enough. We must break the hold that sin has on us. We do that by fully committing ourselves to Jesus and accepting his offer of salvation to us.

"Is Gay marriage Okay?

Interestingly enough, a “Thou shalt perform a marriage ceremony” commandment is not found in scripture (although it is assumed); nor is there a prescription for one. Marriage from a Biblical perspective is, I believe, covenantal within the context of a covenanted people- i.e., Jews (OT) and Christians (NT). Thus, for instance, John the Baptizer was within his covenantal privilege to censure Herod; and Paul was equally exercising his privilege as an Apostle to proscribe marriage practices within the bonds of Christian matrimony.

Jesus explicided stated that:

"from the beginning of the creation God made them male and female." (Mark 10:6)

And follows up with:

 "Therefore what God has joined together, let man not separate." (Mark 10:9)

Which, to me, indicates that Jesus equates "the consumation of the marriage" to the physical act of sexual intercourse between two bodies designed and created for that purpose.

As mentioned, Paul, also seems to follow the same line of thought in his discourses on marriage.

Now, from a sociological perspective, the sanctity of marriage along the Biblically proscribed standards for Christian marriage is a wise politcal choice, but hardly a right of ours as Christians to proscribe to non-Christians, except for political or sociological concerns or reasons.

Personally, I believe that both nature and common sense restricts all sexual activity to the confines of heterosexual matrimony; but as a Christian my moral authority under the Constitution is limited. Nor, do I feel that God has sanctioned me to function as a moral policeman over those of a different persuasion, as long as such activity is between two consenting adults. I may pity them. I may find their sexual activity depraved and disgusting, but we are living under the dispensation of Grace, and grace is patient. Is it sinful? In my books, definitely yes! However, I will wait for God to bring the hammer down on the Judgment Day.

Homosexuality

---------------------------------------------------------------------------
"It is a poor sermon that gives no offence; that neither makes the hearer displeased with himself nor with the preacher." —George Whitefield
---------------------------------------------------------------------------

Recently, I was attacked viciously by a blogger over the gay rights issue.

As carefully as I tried, I was not able to convince the gay activist that, No, I did not hate homosexuals. That, Yes, I believed gays and lesbians should have their constitutional rights along with the rest of us. And, once again, No, I was not a fascist. However, I did inform him that hermeneutically he did not have a leg to stand on if he was going to insist that both Old and New Testament scriptures did not actually forbid any type of homosexual act. Further, I pointed out that the sin of homosexuality was proscribed along with fornication, bestiality and murder, as well as a host of other sins.

Naturally, this sent him into orbit. He then proceed to tell me I was an uneducated fool, and began to shoot question at me like, “As you've apparently studied hermeneutics, what do you think of Jürgen Habermas and Karl-Otto Apel?” As if that had anything to do with the price of tea in China. Well, I was pretty sure it would come as a surprise to him that I had taught sociology and was familiar with the two gentlemen in question. But, I said, that has nothing to do with the issue at hand. Which was, and is, what does the Bible have to say about homosexuality?

Now, much to my discredit—since it should have dawned on me earlier—I quickly discovered that gay and lesbian activists (including those denominations that are ordaining them) have absolutely no respect for the authenticity and integrity of scripture, except to promote their agenda by twisting and contorting it to suit their purposes.

So, I was wasting my breath, and told him so.

This, however, brings me to the subject of witnessing—including, preaching and Biblical interpretation. And, immediately, my mind travels back to a convocation address given by Carl F.H. Henry at Eastern Baptist Theological Seminary some 30 years ago entitled “The Barbarians Are Coming.”

Here is one short quote that I wish to leave with you from that speech, and ask you to reflect upon and pray about, in hopes that it will ignite a missionary fire and zeal in your bellies, as it has mine, to renew your resolve to witness and preach as George Whitefield (quoted above) urged us to so many years ago.

We sit glued to television sets, unmindful that ancient pagan rulers staged Coliseum circuses to switch the minds of the restless ones from the realities of a spiritually-vagrant empire to the illusion that all is basically well .... We are so steeped in the antichrist philosophy-namely, that success consists in embracing not the values of the Sermon on the Mount but an infinity of material things, of sex and status - that we little sense how much of what passes for practical Christianity is really an apostate compromise with the spirit of the age ....Our culture is lost to the truth of God, to the reality of divine revelation, to the content of God's will, to the power of his redemption, and to the authority of his Word. For this loss it is paying dearly in a swift relapse to paganism. The savages are stirring again; you can hear them rumbling and rustling in the tempo of our times. — Carl E. H. Henry, "The Barbarians Are Coming," ABE Journal 2:2 (June 1994), 3-4.

Now, that is something to think about!